A single earth moon time system

[Jan Panteltje]

Researchers figure out how to keep clocks on the Earth, Moon in sync
A single standardized Earth/Moon time would aid communications, enable lunar GPS.
https://arstechnica.com/science/2024/08/researchers-figure-out-how-to-keep-clocks-on-the-earth-moon-in-sync/

eeh, if they ever land on the moon again ;-)

[Martin Brown]

Post by Jan Panteltje
Researchers figure out how to keep clocks on the Earth, Moon in sync
A single standardized Earth/Moon time would aid communications, enable lunar GPS.
https://arstechnica.com/science/2024/08/researchers-figure-out-how-to-keep-clocks-on-the-earth-moon-in-sync/
eeh, if they ever land on the moon again ;-)

I'd say as a proposal it was borderline *insane*. Why complicate time
keeping on Earth where almost everyone lives for the sake a handful of
lunar astronauts. Working in the CoM frame will work but at an enormous
price in the complexity of the equations of motion and book keeping.

Ephemeris or Terrestrial Dynamical Time is good enough. Anyone doing
ultra precise observation will already know how to apply all the
relevant corrections to their data.

The main ones being GRB's detection will be 1s different at the moon due
to light travel time. Clocks on the moon will run a bit faster due to
its much weaker gravity but just like the fix for GPS satellites you
could adjust the divisor so that it appears to tick at SI 1s rate.

For the number of people affected that is by far the simplest way out.

TDT already does well enough for all practical purposes.

https://webspace.science.uu.nl/~gent0113/deltat/deltat.htm

[Jan Panteltje]

On a sunny day (Wed, 14 Aug 2024 10:56:48 +0100) it happened Martin Brown

Post by Martin Brown

Post by Jan Panteltje
Researchers figure out how to keep clocks on the Earth, Moon in sync
A single standardized Earth/Moon time would aid communications, enable lunar GPS.
https://arstechnica.com/science/2024/08/researchers-figure-out-how-to-keep-clocks-on-the-earth-moon-in-sync/
eeh, if they ever land on the moon again ;-)

I'd say as a proposal it was borderline *insane*. Why complicate time
keeping on Earth where almost everyone lives for the sake a handful of
lunar astronauts. Working in the CoM frame will work but at an enormous
price in the complexity of the equations of motion and book keeping.
Ephemeris or Terrestrial Dynamical Time is good enough. Anyone doing
ultra precise observation will already know how to apply all the
relevant corrections to their data.
The main ones being GRB's detection will be 1s different at the moon due
to light travel time. Clocks on the moon will run a bit faster due to
its much weaker gravity but just like the fix for GPS satellites you
could adjust the divisor so that it appears to tick at SI 1s rate.
For the number of people affected that is by far the simplest way out.
TDT already does well enough for all practical purposes.
https://webspace.science.uu.nl/~gent0113/deltat/deltat.htm

Oh yes
I guess that it makes things only more complicated

Time is really a very relative thing..
There was a science program on German TV last week,
they had 2 precision atomic clocks and took one with a car to a local mountain
Sure enough when it was back and they compared the 2 clocks, the mountain one
differed by several nano seconds.
So where on earth do you measure it (time) counts too.

I have a nice Rubidium 10 MHz frequency standard here:
Loading Image...

Locking stuff to it is easy:
Loading Image...

But.. I am almost exactly at sea level, oops, but there are tides...
Tides should also have some effect (moon) on it...

I wish they dumped summer and winter time here. too many clocks to set..

Le Sage also predicts clocks runing slower in a gravity well.
Less LS particles, pendulem gets less compressed, longer... slower
Pendulum or electron orbit..
But as more particles from space than through the earth there must be a spectral widening.
because in the horizonal plane there should be a different field.
So different lengh pendulums are created.
Well, :-)
I have not measured spectral widening of my Rubidium standard yet.

Time is an interesting thing...

[Phil Hobbs]

Post by Martin Brown

Post by Jan Panteltje
Researchers figure out how to keep clocks on the Earth, Moon in sync
A single standardized Earth/Moon time would aid communications, enable lunar GPS.
https://arstechnica.com/science/2024/08/researchers-figure-out-how-to-keep-clocks-on-the-earth-moon-in-sync/
eeh, if they ever land on the moon again ;-)

I'd say as a proposal it was borderline *insane*. Why complicate time
keeping on Earth where almost everyone lives for the sake a handful of
lunar astronauts. Working in the CoM frame will work but at an enormous
price in the complexity of the equations of motion and book keeping.
Ephemeris or Terrestrial Dynamical Time is good enough. Anyone doing
ultra precise observation will already know how to apply all the
relevant corrections to their data.
The main ones being GRB's detection will be 1s different at the moon due
to light travel time. Clocks on the moon will run a bit faster due to
its much weaker gravity but just like the fix for GPS satellites you
could adjust the divisor so that it appears to tick at SI 1s rate.
For the number of people affected that is by far the simplest way out.
TDT already does well enough for all practical purposes.
https://webspace.science.uu.nl/~gent0113/deltat/deltat.htm

You forget the bureaucratic advantages—the European Commission is well
along with its plans to build a suitably massive new headquarters at the
barycenter, to demonstrate that everything does in fact revolve around
them.

The laws of physics show that this position is gravitationally unstable,
but Ms. van der Leyen assures that the laws of the EU take precedence, so
the plan will move forward.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

[Bill Sloman]

Post by Phil Hobbs

Post by Martin Brown

Post by Jan Panteltje
Researchers figure out how to keep clocks on the Earth, Moon in sync
A single standardized Earth/Moon time would aid communications, enable lunar GPS.
https://arstechnica.com/science/2024/08/researchers-figure-out-how-to-keep-clocks-on-the-earth-moon-in-sync/
eeh, if they ever land on the moon again ;-)

I'd say as a proposal it was borderline *insane*. Why complicate time
keeping on Earth where almost everyone lives for the sake a handful of
lunar astronauts. Working in the CoM frame will work but at an enormous
price in the complexity of the equations of motion and book keeping.
Ephemeris or Terrestrial Dynamical Time is good enough. Anyone doing
ultra precise observation will already know how to apply all the
relevant corrections to their data.
The main ones being GRB's detection will be 1s different at the moon due
to light travel time. Clocks on the moon will run a bit faster due to
its much weaker gravity but just like the fix for GPS satellites you
could adjust the divisor so that it appears to tick at SI 1s rate.
For the number of people affected that is by far the simplest way out.
TDT already does well enough for all practical purposes.
https://webspace.science.uu.nl/~gent0113/deltat/deltat.htm

You forget the bureaucratic advantages—the European Commission is well
along with its plans to build a suitably massive new headquarters at the
barycenter, to demonstrate that everything does in fact revolve around
them.
The laws of physics show that this position is gravitationally unstable,
but Ms. van der Leyen assures that the laws of the EU take precedence, so
the plan will move forward.

Don't be silly. European politicians have gone back a bit since Angela
Merkel retired - she had a Ph.D. in Physical Chemistry (as I do) but
hers seems to have been more computational than mine.

Ursula Von der Leyen has a medical degree, which implies a tolerable
grasp of science.

American politicians seem to have be mostly been trained as lawyers, and
may have an irrational confidence in the power of the law to control
reality, but European politicians are mostly more or less sane.
--
Bill Sloman, Sydney