mental imaging

Post by John Larkin
This has been in the science news lately.
https://www.discovermagazine.com/mind/why-some-people-cant-visualize-images-and-may-dream-in-words
Something like one to three per cent of the population can't visualize
objects. I wonder if such people can still design electronics.
And maybe 10% of the population is never really in the dark. They (we)
always see flashing geometric patterns, which are distinct from
hallucinations.

Life is for real
Delusional ideas stay for virtual life.

Population is not something for real.

Just ask your questions to your dad, to some other real persons.

a a

2024-01-03 01:16:58 UTC

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a a

2024-01-03 02:38:19 UTC

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Dan Purgert

2024-01-03 01:07:51 UTC

I can't (or well not well). Like "close your eyes and imagine an apple"
might (*MIGHT*) get me "circle, red, stick out the top" (otherwise, just
the black of the inside of my eyelids.

On the other hand, ask me to draw a shape that'll fold into a cube, and
I'll whip that up right quick (plus tabs for glue, etc). Likewise, stuff
like "will this bookshelf fit on that wall" type things can usually be
generalized to a "yeah, probably" or "notta chance" by eye.

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John Larkin

2024-01-03 03:14:55 UTC

I can't (or well not well). Like "close your eyes and imagine an apple"
might (*MIGHT*) get me "circle, red, stick out the top" (otherwise, just
the black of the inside of my eyelids.
On the other hand, ask me to draw a shape that'll fold into a cube, and
I'll whip that up right quick (plus tabs for glue, etc). Likewise, stuff
like "will this bookshelf fit on that wall" type things can usually be
generalized to a "yeah, probably" or "notta chance" by eye.

That's interesting. You can invent things with a pencil, on paper, but
you can't visualize them?

I can visualize simple circuits, but serious stuff must be drawn. With
a pencil on paper, not CAD. Visualization is often a sort of
out-of-focus image, a hint of what's possible.

I'm very good at sizes and volumes, as whether the leftover soup in
the pot will fit into this square plastic storage thing. Good to about
5% there. I also guess circuit values pretty close. I notice that some
engineers are terrible at estimating magnitudes, like whether PCB
capacitance will affect this circuit (when it won't by a million-to-1)

People are so different.

a a

2024-01-03 06:29:45 UTC

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Dan Purgert

2024-01-03 11:07:44 UTC

I can't (or well not well). Like "close your eyes and imagine an apple"
might (*MIGHT*) get me "circle, red, stick out the top" (otherwise, just
the black of the inside of my eyelids.
On the other hand, ask me to draw a shape that'll fold into a cube, and
I'll whip that up right quick (plus tabs for glue, etc). Likewise, stuff
like "will this bookshelf fit on that wall" type things can usually be
generalized to a "yeah, probably" or "notta chance" by eye.

If by "visualize", you mean "see a picture of it in my head" - no, not
really.

Like I *know* a cube can be made of 6 1" squares laid out in a "t"
pattern; but even describing it here, it's not like I see a picture of
that layout in my head (fuzzy or not). Actually, in the case of this
"foldable template", it's almost more a series of instructions
describing the lines. Not quite as blatant as what I've written below,
but it's the best approximation I can put to paper:

LINE 1.1, 2.1, BOLD
LINE 1.1, 1.2, BOLD
LINE 2.1, 2.2, BOLD
LINE 1.2, 2.2, DASH
[...]

(Instructions -> "Cut on BOLD lines, fold on DASH...")

Post by John Larkin
I'm very good at sizes and volumes, as whether the leftover soup in
the pot will fit into this square plastic storage thing. Good to about
5% there. I also guess circuit values pretty close. I notice that some
engineers are terrible at estimating magnitudes, like whether PCB
capacitance will affect this circuit (when it won't by a million-to-1)

I've not yet had to worry about parasitic loads on a PCB .. but then
again, I'm way down at DC out on the boards (eh, okay, 1 or 2 MHz on an
SPI bus sometimes, but the RF engineers I know [jokingly] told me that's
basically just DC anyway ;) )

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a a

2024-01-03 14:27:27 UTC

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a a

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a a

2024-01-03 06:29:39 UTC

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Martin Brown

2024-01-03 15:07:57 UTC

It probably isn't a massive handicap to them unless they want to become
a sculptor or an artist. They cannot visualise things or recall images.

I rely on my visual memory to figure some problems out and then write
them down. I have known people who could solve serious mathematical
problems without writing anything down at all - that is impressive.

Playing blindfold chess is another visual memory trick worthy of note.

Visual memory can also defeat some of the oft used simple tests for
Alzheimers since one of them is apple, ball and chair - visualising that
scene bypasses the memory paths that they are trying to test.

Post by John Larkin
And maybe 10% of the population is never really in the dark. They (we)
always see flashing geometric patterns, which are distinct from
hallucinations.

Depending how dark your environment you see thermal shot noise on the
retina after a few hours in true total darkness.
As in photographic manufacturing plant darkroom conditions or deep cave.
It is darker in there than the darkest outdoors.

BTW Happy New Year

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John Larkin

2024-01-03 15:54:39 UTC

On Wed, 3 Jan 2024 15:07:57 +0000, Martin Brown

It probably isn't a massive handicap to them unless they want to become
a sculptor or an artist. They cannot visualise things or recall images.
I rely on my visual memory to figure some problems out and then write
them down. I have known people who could solve serious mathematical
problems without writing anything down at all - that is impressive.
Playing blindfold chess is another visual memory trick worthy of note.
Visual memory can also defeat some of the oft used simple tests for
Alzheimers since one of them is apple, ball and chair - visualising that
scene bypasses the memory paths that they are trying to test.

Post by John Larkin
And maybe 10% of the population is never really in the dark. They (we)
always see flashing geometric patterns, which are distinct from
hallucinations.

I see a sort of fireworks display in the dark, with occasional
geometric patterns. I once had a concussion and they went away for a
few days. You normal people live in DARKNESS!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phosphene

Post by Martin Brown
BTW Happy New Year

Ditto. It may not seem like it, but the world is actually getting
better.

a a

2024-01-03 20:35:54 UTC

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bitrex

2024-01-04 04:15:13 UTC

Post by John Larkin
On Wed, 3 Jan 2024 15:07:57 +0000, Martin Brown

It probably isn't a massive handicap to them unless they want to become
a sculptor or an artist. They cannot visualise things or recall images.
I rely on my visual memory to figure some problems out and then write
them down. I have known people who could solve serious mathematical
problems without writing anything down at all - that is impressive.
Playing blindfold chess is another visual memory trick worthy of note.
Visual memory can also defeat some of the oft used simple tests for
Alzheimers since one of them is apple, ball and chair - visualising that
scene bypasses the memory paths that they are trying to test.

Post by John Larkin
And maybe 10% of the population is never really in the dark. They (we)
always see flashing geometric patterns, which are distinct from
hallucinations.

About 150 mg of dextromethorphan hydrobromide and in a few hours in a
dark room you'll be seeing arcade game racecars zipping across the walls
like Frogger, not a problem at all.

Not recommended. Good news is I never got into mescaline or any of that
in my younger days.

Post by Martin Brown
BTW Happy New Year

Ditto. It may not seem like it, but the world is actually getting
better.

John Larkin

2024-01-04 05:59:00 UTC

Post by John Larkin
On Wed, 3 Jan 2024 15:07:57 +0000, Martin Brown

It probably isn't a massive handicap to them unless they want to become
a sculptor or an artist. They cannot visualise things or recall images.
I rely on my visual memory to figure some problems out and then write
them down. I have known people who could solve serious mathematical
problems without writing anything down at all - that is impressive.
Playing blindfold chess is another visual memory trick worthy of note.
Visual memory can also defeat some of the oft used simple tests for
Alzheimers since one of them is apple, ball and chair - visualising that
scene bypasses the memory paths that they are trying to test.

Post by John Larkin
And maybe 10% of the population is never really in the dark. They (we)
always see flashing geometric patterns, which are distinct from
hallucinations.

About 150 mg of dextromethorphan hydrobromide and in a few hours in a
dark room you'll be seeing arcade game racecars zipping across the walls
like Frogger, not a problem at all.
Not recommended. Good news is I never got into mescaline or any of that
in my younger days.

I'm basically crazy enough that chemicals don't make much difference.
A lady once gave me some LSD at Mardi Gras and I thought it made
things duller than normal.

I also get migraine auras, which are interesting, but I don't get the
usual follow-on headache. My favorites are hallucinations, which are
beautiful and colorful and in perfect focus, a nice experience for
someone who has always had mediocre eyesight.

After two vitectomies, my giant structural floaters are gone and I
have tiny ones now, some of which look like energetically swimming
tadpoles. I think they must be some sort of cells.

Optics is cool.

a a

2024-01-04 06:37:32 UTC

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2024-01-04 06:37:25 UTC

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a a

2024-01-03 16:09:49 UTC

It probably isn't a massive handicap to them unless they want to become
a sculptor or an artist. They cannot visualise things or recall images.
I rely on my visual memory to figure some problems out and then write
them down. I have known people who could solve serious mathematical
problems without writing anything down at all - that is impressive.
Playing blindfold chess is another visual memory trick worthy of note.
Visual memory can also defeat some of the oft used simple tests for
Alzheimers since one of them is apple, ball and chair - visualising that
scene bypasses the memory paths that they are trying to test.

Post by John Larkin
And maybe 10% of the population is never really in the dark. They (we)
always see flashing geometric patterns, which are distinct from
hallucinations.

Internet magazines keep publishing fake stories to attract readers to not collapse

Never read fake stories like that
to keep your mind clean, not infected by hoax virus

a a

2024-01-03 16:21:13 UTC

Darius the Dumb has posted yet one more #veryStupidByLowIQaa article.

a a

2024-01-03 17:07:08 UTC

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Don Y

2024-01-03 16:59:32 UTC

It probably isn't a massive handicap to them unless they want to become a
sculptor or an artist. They cannot visualise things or recall images.

We have a friend who is also a (artistic) painter. When out with
his colleagues, they will be painting a *desert* scene -- and Tony
is off painting images of the seashore.

"Tony, why do you even come out with us on these /plein air/ jaunts?
You're NEVER 'here'..."

I rely on my visual memory to figure some problems out and then write them
down. I have known people who could solve serious mathematical problems without
writing anything down at all - that is impressive.

I rely (heavily) on visual abstractions to plan how processes interact.
Most folks have "single threaded" ideas of the world -- which can
be a downside when designing hardware or (modern) software. Particularly
distributed systems where many things ARE happening concurrently and
transport delays are *tangible*!

Playing blindfold chess is another visual memory trick worthy of note.

I am amused by the things that I can *visualize* but can't reify.
One would assume that "seeing it" should correlate with being
able to (re)create it...

[I am also amused by how much WORSE my auditory learning channel is
than visual.]

Visual memory can also defeat some of the oft used simple tests for Alzheimers
since one of them is apple, ball and chair - visualising that scene bypasses
the memory paths that they are trying to test.

Likewise cognitive skills. I can recall very long strings of digits
if I can *see* them written down; less so if read to me (in which case,
I *imagine* writing them down). And, simple arithmetic (often fails
in alzheimers pts) is just a bunch of digit sequences that flash in
my mind, without thinking about how they are (algorithmically) "formed".

I met a /savant/, once. His "skill" was scary. But, like many (most)
/savants/, not very "deep". :<

a a

2024-01-03 20:36:00 UTC

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2024-01-03 20:35:48 UTC

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Martin Rid

2024-01-03 17:21:08 UTC

This has been in the science news lately.https://www.discovermagazine.com/mind/why-some-people-cant-visualize-images-and-may-dream-in-wordsSomething like one to three per cent of the population can't visualizeobjects. I wonder if such people can still design electronics.And maybe 10% of the population is never really in the dark. They (we)always see flashing geometric patterns, which are distinct fromhallucinations.

I wonder if that's related to not having an 'Internal monologue '.
Eg; talking to oneself.

Cheers

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a a

2024-01-03 20:36:06 UTC

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Dan Purgert

2024-01-04 11:48:28 UTC

Post by Martin Rid

Post by John Larkin
This has been in the science news
lately. [...]
like one to three per cent of the population can't visualizeobjects.
I wonder if such people can still design electronics.And maybe 10% of
the population is never really in the dark. They (we)always see
flashing geometric patterns, which are distinct fromhallucinations.

I wonder if that's related to not having an 'Internal monologue '.
Eg; talking to oneself.

It's the only intelligent conversation I can get some days :)

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a a

2024-01-04 17:03:18 UTC

The arsehole Dan Purgert <***@djph.net> persisting in being an Off-topic troll...
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Subject: Re: mental imaging
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john larkin

2024-01-04 18:51:40 UTC

On Wed, 3 Jan 2024 12:21:08 -0500 (EST), Martin Rid

Post by Martin Rid

This has been in the science news lately.https://www.discovermagazine.com/mind/why-some-people-cant-visualize-images-and-may-dream-in-wordsSomething like one to three per cent of the population can't visualizeobjects. I wonder if such people can still design electronics.And maybe 10% of the population is never really in the dark. They (we)always see flashing geometric patterns, which are distinct fromhallucinations.

I wonder if that's related to not having an 'Internal monologue '.
Eg; talking to oneself.
Cheers

Some people really talk to themselves, out loud, which can be
confusing to others.

Martin Rid

2024-01-05 17:34:34 UTC

I'm referring to internal, not out loud. Search 'internal
monologue ' on youtube. It's interesting, never knew there were
people like that.

Cheers

--
----Android NewsGroup Reader----
https://piaohong.s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/usenet/index.html

Phil Hobbs

2024-01-05 16:46:12 UTC

Post by Martin Rid
I'm referring to internal, not out loud. Search 'internal
monologue ' on youtube. It's interesting, never knew there were
people like that.
Cheers

I have a very quiet mind like that, but I can speak in my head. One of
my sisters can't--if she wants to work out what she's planning to say,
she has to say it under her breath.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com

Jasen Betts

2024-03-06 12:09:55 UTC

Post by Martin Rid
I'm referring to internal, not out loud. Search 'internal
monologue ' on youtube. It's interesting, never knew there were
people like that.

It's a real thing, but it doesn't come with a reverb effect
like in the movies.

--
Jasen.
🇺🇦 Слава Україні

a a

2024-03-10 06:07:08 UTC

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legg

2024-01-06 15:40:16 UTC

Why would you have to close your eyes to 'visualize' something?

I think someone's confusing vision with activity in the brain.

RL

a a

2024-01-06 16:08:04 UTC

The idiot legg <***@nospam.magma.ca> persisting in being an Off-topic troll...
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john larkin

2024-01-08 20:27:42 UTC

Post by legg

Why would you have to close your eyes to 'visualize' something?

Some people close their eyes to better hear voices or music, or
appreciate flavors or whatever. Or kiss.

Post by legg
I think someone's confusing vision with activity in the brain.

Both need brain bandwidth.

In some university math departments, a professor's office has a couch
where they can recline and close their eyes think about mathematics
and get paid, too.

I have my best ideas while I'm asleep. 100% available brain bandwidth.

When do you get your best electronic design ideas?

Post by legg
RL

Dan Purgert

2024-01-09 01:46:47 UTC

Post by john larkin
[...]
When do you get your best electronic design ideas?

When I've had a chance to relax (note - they're still *bad* by good long
way ;) )

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John Larkin

2024-01-09 03:02:43 UTC

Post by john larkin
[...]
When do you get your best electronic design ideas?

When I've had a chance to relax (note - they're still *bad* by good long
way ;) )

My mental model is that, given some modest kit of components, there is
a multidimensional "solution space" of possible circuits that could be
made from them. With, say, 200 parts the number of possible circuits
exceeds the number of electrons in the universe. All the digikey parts
make more. So how does one search that space in, say, a few hours or
days?

Use quantum computing. Set up a goodness mask and apply it to all of
them simultaneously.

Phil Hobbs

2024-01-09 03:14:00 UTC

Post by john larkin
[...]
When do you get your best electronic design ideas?

When I've had a chance to relax (note - they're still *bad* by good long
way ;) )

My mental model is that, given some modest kit of components, there is
a multidimensional "solution space" of possible circuits that could be
made from them. With, say, 200 parts the number of possible circuits
exceeds the number of electrons in the universe. All the digikey parts
make more. So how does one search that space in, say, a few hours or
days?
Use quantum computing. Set up a goodness mask and apply it to all of
them simultaneously.

;)

‘Tain’t that hard a problem—it doesn’t have to be the ultimate, most
cosmically optimal solution—it just needs to work right, and (ideally) be
pretty enough to be satisfying to the designer.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs Principal Consultant ElectroOptical Innovations LLC /
Hobbs ElectroOptics Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics

a a

2024-01-09 23:59:38 UTC

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Anthony William Sloman

2024-01-09 03:28:46 UTC

Post by john larkin
[...]
When do you get your best electronic design ideas?

When I've had a chance to relax (note - they're still *bad* by good long
way ;) )

My mental model is that, given some modest kit of components, there is
a multidimensional "solution space" of possible circuits that could be
made from them. With, say, 200 parts the number of possible circuits
exceeds the number of electrons in the universe. All the digikey parts
make more. So how does one search that space in, say, a few hours or
days?
Use quantum computing. Set up a goodness mask and apply it to all of
them simultaneously.

Of course, setting up a "goodness" mask involves working out what you want the circuit to do, and one vital part of invention involves seeing that there is a problem that could be solved. Once you've defined the problem, the solution can be trivial.

Politicians define lots of problems, most of which don't actually exist, and then tout their "solutions". Hitler thought that German needed more living space. Donald Trump seems to have though that the US needed fewer immigrants.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

a a

2024-01-09 23:59:18 UTC

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Tabby

2024-01-11 21:37:50 UTC

Post by Anthony William Sloman

Post by john larkin
[...]
When do you get your best electronic design ideas?

When I've had a chance to relax (note - they're still *bad* by good long
way ;) )

My mental model is that, given some modest kit of components, there is
a multidimensional "solution space" of possible circuits that could be
made from them. With, say, 200 parts the number of possible circuits
exceeds the number of electrons in the universe. All the digikey parts
make more. So how does one search that space in, say, a few hours or
days?
Use quantum computing. Set up a goodness mask and apply it to all of
them simultaneously.

Of course, setting up a "goodness" mask involves working out what you want the circuit to do, and one vital part of invention involves seeing that there is a problem that could be solved. Once you've defined the problem, the solution can be trivial.
Politicians define lots of problems, most of which don't actually exist, and then tout their "solutions". Hitler thought that German needed more living space. Donald Trump seems to have though that the US needed fewer immigrants.

I thought his lebensraum was just an excuse to kill people & steal their stuff.

a a

2024-01-11 22:20:49 UTC

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Bill Sloman

2024-01-12 06:43:20 UTC

Post by Anthony William Sloman

Post by Tabby

Post by john larkin
[...]
When do you get your best electronic design ideas?

When I've had a chance to relax (note - they're still *bad* by good long
way ;) )

My mental model is that, given some modest kit of components, there is
a multidimensional "solution space" of possible circuits that could be
made from them. With, say, 200 parts the number of possible circuits
exceeds the number of electrons in the universe. All the digikey parts
make more. So how does one search that space in, say, a few hours or
days?
Use quantum computing. Set up a goodness mask and apply it to all of
them simultaneously.

Of course, setting up a "goodness" mask involves working out what you want the circuit to do, and one vital part of invention involves seeing that there is a problem that could be solved. Once you've defined the problem, the solution can be trivial.
Politicians define lots of problems, most of which don't actually exist, and then tout their "solutions". Hitler thought that German needed more living space. Donald Trump seems to have though that the US needed fewer immigrants.

I thought his lebensraum was just an excuse to kill people & steal their stuff.

That makes it a typical example of the "problems" that politicians
define and propose to solve. Killing people was a incidental side effect
- stealing their stuff - mainly their land - was the solution he was
selling.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

darius

2024-01-12 17:50:28 UTC

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a a

2024-01-09 23:59:32 UTC

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bitrex

2024-01-11 03:46:46 UTC

Post by john larkin
[...]
When do you get your best electronic design ideas?

When I've had a chance to relax (note - they're still *bad* by good long
way ;) )

My mental model is that, given some modest kit of components, there is
a multidimensional "solution space" of possible circuits that could be
made from them. With, say, 200 parts the number of possible circuits
exceeds the number of electrons in the universe. All the digikey parts
make more. So how does one search that space in, say, a few hours or
days?
Use quantum computing. Set up a goodness mask and apply it to all of
them simultaneously.

There's a standard "mental imagery vividness test":

<https://aphantasia.com/study/vviq/>

Apparently there's a condition called "aphantasia" where the person is
unable to visualize imagery in their "minds eye" and can only think in
words. Purportedly more common among engineers though I'm unsure what if
any disciplines are involved.

But total aphantasia is rare and it's a matter of degree, I expect
people who are strongly phantasic might like fiction significantly more
- imagine being able to pick up a book and visualize its contents very
strongly almost like you were watching a film. Sure save money on Netflix.

I'm not a big fiction fan, I was moreso as a kid. My test rates me
somewhere in the middle, not sure if it's an ability that perhaps tends
to decline with age and is strongest in children.

--
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
www.avast.com

John Larkin

2024-01-11 14:37:59 UTC

Post by john larkin
[...]
When do you get your best electronic design ideas?

When I've had a chance to relax (note - they're still *bad* by good long
way ;) )

My mental model is that, given some modest kit of components, there is
a multidimensional "solution space" of possible circuits that could be
made from them. With, say, 200 parts the number of possible circuits
exceeds the number of electrons in the universe. All the digikey parts
make more. So how does one search that space in, say, a few hours or
days?
Use quantum computing. Set up a goodness mask and apply it to all of
them simultaneously.

<https://aphantasia.com/study/vviq/>
Apparently there's a condition called "aphantasia" where the person is
unable to visualize imagery in their "minds eye" and can only think in
words. Purportedly more common among engineers though I'm unsure what if
any disciplines are involved.

Interesting. I would have expected that all engineers visualize.

Many engineers are bad with words. I know a couple that freely
substitute milli and micro, and capacitor and inductor, when speaking.
That creates difficulties. Lots of engineers stutter, or can't find
common words.

Post by bitrex
But total aphantasia is rare and it's a matter of degree, I expect
people who are strongly phantasic might like fiction significantly more
- imagine being able to pick up a book and visualize its contents very
strongly almost like you were watching a film. Sure save money on Netflix.
I'm not a big fiction fan, I was moreso as a kid. My test rates me
somewhere in the middle, not sure if it's an ability that perhaps tends
to decline with age and is strongest in children.

I loved sci-fi as a kid, but find it lame and boring now. But I hated
classics, Jane Austin and Shakespeare sorts of stuff, but love it now.

Fortunately, I can still design electronics. I visualize basic
circuits but have to draw them to really think about them. I go
through absurd numbers of grid pads and uniball pens. The Amazon
Basics pads are pretty good.

LT Spice is a great aid to thinking.

When I was 30, I had designed hundreds of PCBs and could draw any of
their schematics from memory. I can't do that any more. No big deal,
they are on my computer now.

Joe Gwinn

2024-01-11 15:04:30 UTC

Post by john larkin
[...]
When do you get your best electronic design ideas?

When I've had a chance to relax (note - they're still *bad* by good long
way ;) )

My mental model is that, given some modest kit of components, there is
a multidimensional "solution space" of possible circuits that could be
made from them. With, say, 200 parts the number of possible circuits
exceeds the number of electrons in the universe. All the digikey parts
make more. So how does one search that space in, say, a few hours or
days?
Use quantum computing. Set up a goodness mask and apply it to all of
them simultaneously.

Interesting. I would have expected that all engineers visualize.
Many engineers are bad with words. I know a couple that freely
substitute milli and micro, and capacitor and inductor, when speaking.
That creates difficulties. Lots of engineers stutter, or can't find
common words.

I took Western Civilization in college (graduated with a BSEE in 1969)
- the Professor was spellbinding, and his lectures were standing room
only in the largest lecture hall on campus.

My Teaching Assistant for Western Civilization had started out in the
EE department, and switched to History about half way through. Why?

He said that while he was passing all the academic courses with good
grades, he had observed that his fellow EE students could "see" the
electrons flowing, and so could jump directly to the solution.

But he could not see those electrons, and so had to analyze his way
from first principles, which would be far too slow to be competitive
in a real EE job.

So he switched majors. My reaction at the time was that he was
exactly correct, and that switching was a very wise decision.

Joe Gwinn

bitrex

2024-01-11 18:13:48 UTC

Post by john larkin
[...]
When do you get your best electronic design ideas?

When I've had a chance to relax (note - they're still *bad* by good long
way ;) )

My mental model is that, given some modest kit of components, there is
a multidimensional "solution space" of possible circuits that could be
made from them. With, say, 200 parts the number of possible circuits
exceeds the number of electrons in the universe. All the digikey parts
make more. So how does one search that space in, say, a few hours or
days?
Use quantum computing. Set up a goodness mask and apply it to all of
them simultaneously.

Interesting. I would have expected that all engineers visualize.
Many engineers are bad with words. I know a couple that freely
substitute milli and micro, and capacitor and inductor, when speaking.
That creates difficulties. Lots of engineers stutter, or can't find
common words.

I took Western Civilization in college (graduated with a BSEE in 1969)
- the Professor was spellbinding, and his lectures were standing room
only in the largest lecture hall on campus.
My Teaching Assistant for Western Civilization had started out in the
EE department, and switched to History about half way through. Why?
He said that while he was passing all the academic courses with good
grades, he had observed that his fellow EE students could "see" the
electrons flowing, and so could jump directly to the solution.
But he could not see those electrons, and so had to analyze his way
from first principles, which would be far too slow to be competitive
in a real EE job.
So he switched majors. My reaction at the time was that he was
exactly correct, and that switching was a very wise decision.
Joe Gwinn

I also grew up around white male Americans. and an important step in my
professional development was ignoring the overwhelming majority of
stories dudes tell like "I can see the electrons flowing" "I knew I
wouldn't be competitive enough so I...", "Yeah Susan is totally into me,
we banged the other night, bro" and all the fantastical stories dudes
regularly tell, which even many children who still believe in Santa
Claus and the tooth fairy would be straight-up too insightful to take
particularly seriously.

a a

2024-01-11 19:05:55 UTC

The arsehole bitrex <***@example.net> persisting in being an Off-topic troll...
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john larkin

2024-01-11 19:15:26 UTC

Post by john larkin
[...]
When do you get your best electronic design ideas?

When I've had a chance to relax (note - they're still *bad* by good long
way ;) )

My mental model is that, given some modest kit of components, there is
a multidimensional "solution space" of possible circuits that could be
made from them. With, say, 200 parts the number of possible circuits
exceeds the number of electrons in the universe. All the digikey parts
make more. So how does one search that space in, say, a few hours or
days?
Use quantum computing. Set up a goodness mask and apply it to all of
them simultaneously.

Interesting. I would have expected that all engineers visualize.
Many engineers are bad with words. I know a couple that freely
substitute milli and micro, and capacitor and inductor, when speaking.
That creates difficulties. Lots of engineers stutter, or can't find
common words.

I took Western Civilization in college (graduated with a BSEE in 1969)
- the Professor was spellbinding, and his lectures were standing room
only in the largest lecture hall on campus.
My Teaching Assistant for Western Civilization had started out in the
EE department, and switched to History about half way through. Why?
He said that while he was passing all the academic courses with good
grades, he had observed that his fellow EE students could "see" the
electrons flowing, and so could jump directly to the solution.
But he could not see those electrons, and so had to analyze his way
from first principles, which would be far too slow to be competitive
in a real EE job.
So he switched majors. My reaction at the time was that he was
exactly correct, and that switching was a very wise decision.
Joe Gwinn

I can see the current flowing on a schematic. But positive charges,
not electrons.

Probably some non-white non-male people can too.

darius

2024-01-11 19:45:05 UTC

The arsehole john larkin <***@650pot.com> persisting in being an Off-topic troll...
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bitrex

2024-01-11 20:39:08 UTC

Post by john larkin

Post by john larkin
[...]
When do you get your best electronic design ideas?

When I've had a chance to relax (note - they're still *bad* by good long
way ;) )

My mental model is that, given some modest kit of components, there is
a multidimensional "solution space" of possible circuits that could be
made from them. With, say, 200 parts the number of possible circuits
exceeds the number of electrons in the universe. All the digikey parts
make more. So how does one search that space in, say, a few hours or
days?
Use quantum computing. Set up a goodness mask and apply it to all of
them simultaneously.

Interesting. I would have expected that all engineers visualize.
Many engineers are bad with words. I know a couple that freely
substitute milli and micro, and capacitor and inductor, when speaking.
That creates difficulties. Lots of engineers stutter, or can't find
common words.

I took Western Civilization in college (graduated with a BSEE in 1969)
- the Professor was spellbinding, and his lectures were standing room
only in the largest lecture hall on campus.
My Teaching Assistant for Western Civilization had started out in the
EE department, and switched to History about half way through. Why?
He said that while he was passing all the academic courses with good
grades, he had observed that his fellow EE students could "see" the
electrons flowing, and so could jump directly to the solution.
But he could not see those electrons, and so had to analyze his way
from first principles, which would be far too slow to be competitive
in a real EE job.
So he switched majors. My reaction at the time was that he was
exactly correct, and that switching was a very wise decision.
Joe Gwinn

I can see the current flowing on a schematic. But positive charges,
not electrons.
Probably some non-white non-male people can too.

I think it's a skill that can be learned with practice like many others.
and the main reason people stop doing things and get out of certain
avenues of study is they just don't like doing them.

The whole "I knew I wouldn't be competitive"-thing sounds like a
back-rationalization to me, "I got out of EE because I wasn't getting
much out of it and I wasn't really motivated by the material" is much
more common, but not as cute a story.

Young adults are fickle, I wanted to be in a big time rock band at age
20. Sounds dreadful to me now but the heart wants what the heart wants
in the moment. I was into cognitive science for a while too but the
department professors were uninspiring and the material annoyingly
abstruse at least for me at 20.

bitrex

2024-01-11 20:50:44 UTC

Post by john larkin

Post by john larkin
[...]
When do you get your best electronic design ideas?

When I've had a chance to relax (note - they're still *bad* by good long
way ;) )

My mental model is that, given some modest kit of components, there is
a multidimensional "solution space" of possible circuits that could be
made from them. With, say, 200 parts the number of possible circuits
exceeds the number of electrons in the universe. All the digikey parts
make more. So how does one search that space in, say, a few hours or
days?
Use quantum computing. Set up a goodness mask and apply it to all of
them simultaneously.

Interesting. I would have expected that all engineers visualize.
Many engineers are bad with words. I know a couple that freely
substitute milli and micro, and capacitor and inductor, when speaking.
That creates difficulties. Lots of engineers stutter, or can't find
common words.

I took Western Civilization in college (graduated with a BSEE in 1969)
- the Professor was spellbinding, and his lectures were standing room
only in the largest lecture hall on campus.
My Teaching Assistant for Western Civilization had started out in the
EE department, and switched to History about half way through. Why?
He said that while he was passing all the academic courses with good
grades, he had observed that his fellow EE students could "see" the
electrons flowing, and so could jump directly to the solution.
But he could not see those electrons, and so had to analyze his way
from first principles, which would be far too slow to be competitive
in a real EE job.
So he switched majors. My reaction at the time was that he was
exactly correct, and that switching was a very wise decision.
Joe Gwinn

I can see the current flowing on a schematic. But positive charges,
not electrons.
Probably some non-white non-male people can too.

I think it's a skill that can be learned with practice like many others.
and the main reason people stop doing things and get out of certain
avenues of study is they just don't like doing them.
The whole "I knew I wouldn't be competitive"-thing sounds like a
back-rationalization to me, "I got out of EE because I wasn't getting
much out of it and I wasn't really motivated by the material" is much
more common, but not as cute a story.
Young adults are fickle, I wanted to be in a big time rock band at age
20. Sounds dreadful to me now but the heart wants what the heart wants
in the moment. I was into cognitive science for a while too but the
department professors were uninspiring and the material annoyingly
abstruse at least for me at 20.

Incidentally I think another reason people leave engineering tracks is
that the quality of the didaction at anything but top-tier US
universities tends to range from just okay to abysmal.

a a

2024-01-11 22:21:17 UTC