Raspberry Pi pico2 launches with an ARM and a Risc V processor core

Discussion:

(too old to reply)

Jan Panteltje

2024-08-10 09:09:22 UTC

Raspberry Pi Pico 2 Launches with Arm + Risc V Cores: hands-on with the new, $5 microcontroller
https://www.tomshardware.com/raspberry-pi/raspberry-pi-pico/raspberry-pi-pico-2-launches-with-arm-risc-v-cores-hands-on-with-the-new-dollar5-microcontroller#main

So 2 processors for 5 $

Comparing some features

Raspberry Pi Pico
SoC: RP2040, Dual Core Arm Cortex M0+ running at up to 133 MH
SRAM: 264 K
Flash Storage: 2MB QSPI
3 x 12 bit ADC
sleep mode < 100 uA

Raspberry Pi Pico 2
SoC: RP2350, Dual Core Arm Cortex M33 or Dual Core RISC-V Hazard3 running at up to 150 MHz
SRAM: 520 KB
Flash Storage: 4MB QSPI
Security: Arm TrustZone, 8KB OTP, Secure Boot
4 x 12 bit ADC
sleep mode < 10 uA

More in the above link.

John Larkin

2024-08-10 16:45:36 UTC

Permalink

Post by Jan Panteltje
Raspberry Pi Pico 2 Launches with Arm + Risc V Cores: hands-on with the new, $5 microcontroller
https://www.tomshardware.com/raspberry-pi/raspberry-pi-pico/raspberry-pi-pico-2-launches-with-arm-risc-v-cores-hands-on-with-the-new-dollar5-microcontroller#main
So 2 processors for 5 $
Comparing some features
Raspberry Pi Pico
SoC: RP2040, Dual Core Arm Cortex M0+ running at up to 133 MH
SRAM: 264 K
Flash Storage: 2MB QSPI
3 x 12 bit ADC
sleep mode < 100 uA
Raspberry Pi Pico 2
SoC: RP2350, Dual Core Arm Cortex M33 or Dual Core RISC-V Hazard3 running at up to 150 MHz
SRAM: 520 KB
Flash Storage: 4MB QSPI
Security: Arm TrustZone, 8KB OTP, Secure Boot
4 x 12 bit ADC
sleep mode < 10 uA
More in the above link.

That's amazing. The Pi stuff is incredible.

We're designing around the RP2040 chip now. Dual-core ARM for 70
cents. It's rated at 133 MHz max, but overclocks to about 400. Some
lunatic froze one and ran the core voltage up and got it to work at 1
GHz.

We're now designing an interposer board, to connect to a Pi 400 on one
end and to a 20-pin ribbon cable, to our DUTs, on the other, for
development and for production test both. I can post the schematic if
anyone is interested.

Jan Panteltje

2024-08-11 05:53:49 UTC

Permalink

On a sunny day (Sat, 10 Aug 2024 09:45:36 -0700) it happened John Larkin

Post by John Larkin

That's amazing. The Pi stuff is incredible.
We're designing around the RP2040 chip now. Dual-core ARM for 70
cents. It's rated at 133 MHz max, but overclocks to about 400. Some
lunatic froze one and ran the core voltage up and got it to work at 1
GHz.
We're now designing an interposer board, to connect to a Pi 400 on one
end and to a 20-pin ribbon cable, to our DUTs, on the other, for
development and for production test both. I can post the schematic if
anyone is interested.

I am curious to the performance of that RISC-V processor core.
I may order a Pico 2 if I see it in the webshops here (not yet it seems, just checked).

John Larkin

2024-08-11 19:02:20 UTC

Permalink

Post by Jan Panteltje
On a sunny day (Sat, 10 Aug 2024 09:45:36 -0700) it happened John Larkin

Post by John Larkin

That's amazing. The Pi stuff is incredible.
We're designing around the RP2040 chip now. Dual-core ARM for 70
cents. It's rated at 133 MHz max, but overclocks to about 400. Some
lunatic froze one and ran the core voltage up and got it to work at 1
GHz.
We're now designing an interposer board, to connect to a Pi 400 on one
end and to a 20-pin ribbon cable, to our DUTs, on the other, for
development and for production test both. I can post the schematic if
anyone is interested.

I am curious to the performance of that RISC-V processor core.
I may order a Pico 2 if I see it in the webshops here (not yet it seems, just checked).

It is strange to get a choice of CPU!

I'd expect that at the bit-bang level, performance will be about the
same. On a 2040 ARM chip, we can bit-bang a gpio port and make a train
of 7 ns pulses, which is single cycles with a 133 Mhz clock. RiscV
can't do better than that.

It would be cool if the floating point ops were faster, in either
mode. On a 2040, the usual single-precision things take ballpark 600
ns.

Dave Platt

2024-08-11 19:34:56 UTC

Permalink

Post by John Larkin
It would be cool if the floating point ops were faster, in either
mode. On a 2040, the usual single-precision things take ballpark 600
ns.

Almost certainly will be!

The 2040 uses an M0 processor core, which doesn't have a hardware
floating point-unit. It has floating-point emulation libraries in the
ROM.

The 2350 uses an M33 processor core, which has a single-precision
hardware floating-point unit.

As long as your needs are met by single-precision floating point, and
can recompile your code with floating-point instructions enabled, the
2350 should be quite a bit faster than the 2040.

Dennis

2024-08-11 23:11:00 UTC

Permalink

Post by Dave Platt
The 2350 uses an M33 processor core, which has a single-precision
hardware floating-point unit.

For double they have an assist co-processor that speeds up parts of the
operations with multiple instructions to do the operation.By using the
assist processor for the core function they can significantly reduce the
hardware while still getting a speed up since the rest of the code to
implement the function needs fewer instructions than a full software
implementation.

See section 3.6.2
https://datasheets.raspberrypi.com/rp2350/rp2350-datasheet.pdf

Jan Panteltje

2024-08-12 00:09:24 UTC

Permalink

On a sunny day (Sun, 11 Aug 2024 18:11:00 -0500) it happened Dennis

Post by Dennis

Post by Dave Platt
The 2350 uses an M33 processor core, which has a single-precision
hardware floating-point unit.

For double they have an assist co-processor that speeds up parts of the
operations with multiple instructions to do the operation.By using the
assist processor for the core function they can significantly reduce the
hardware while still getting a speed up since the rest of the code to
implement the function needs fewer instructions than a full software
implementation.
See section 3.6.2
https://datasheets.raspberrypi.com/rp2350/rp2350-datasheet.pdf

Nice, thank you
1347 pages....
:-)

Jan Panteltje

2024-08-12 00:03:52 UTC

Permalink

On a sunny day (Sun, 11 Aug 2024 12:02:20 -0700) it happened John Larkin

Post by John Larkin

Post by Jan Panteltje
On a sunny day (Sat, 10 Aug 2024 09:45:36 -0700) it happened John Larkin

Post by John Larkin

That's amazing. The Pi stuff is incredible.
We're designing around the RP2040 chip now. Dual-core ARM for 70
cents. It's rated at 133 MHz max, but overclocks to about 400. Some
lunatic froze one and ran the core voltage up and got it to work at 1
GHz.
We're now designing an interposer board, to connect to a Pi 400 on one
end and to a 20-pin ribbon cable, to our DUTs, on the other, for
development and for production test both. I can post the schematic if
anyone is interested.

I am curious to the performance of that RISC-V processor core.
I may order a Pico 2 if I see it in the webshops here (not yet it seems, just checked).

It is strange to get a choice of CPU!
I'd expect that at the bit-bang level, performance will be about the
same. On a 2040 ARM chip, we can bit-bang a gpio port and make a train
of 7 ns pulses, which is single cycles with a 133 Mhz clock. RiscV
can't do better than that.
It would be cool if the floating point ops were faster, in either
mode. On a 2040, the usual single-precision things take ballpark 600
ns.

C compiler may make a difference, need GCC with output for that processor.
I have no idea, likely will get some development package with the right gcc.

Sylvia Else

2024-08-14 10:56:49 UTC

Permalink

Post by Jan Panteltje
On a sunny day (Sun, 11 Aug 2024 12:02:20 -0700) it happened John Larkin

Post by John Larkin

Post by Jan Panteltje
On a sunny day (Sat, 10 Aug 2024 09:45:36 -0700) it happened John Larkin

Post by John Larkin

That's amazing. The Pi stuff is incredible.
We're designing around the RP2040 chip now. Dual-core ARM for 70
cents. It's rated at 133 MHz max, but overclocks to about 400. Some
lunatic froze one and ran the core voltage up and got it to work at 1
GHz.
We're now designing an interposer board, to connect to a Pi 400 on one
end and to a 20-pin ribbon cable, to our DUTs, on the other, for
development and for production test both. I can post the schematic if
anyone is interested.

I am curious to the performance of that RISC-V processor core.
I may order a Pico 2 if I see it in the webshops here (not yet it seems, just checked).

It is strange to get a choice of CPU!
I'd expect that at the bit-bang level, performance will be about the
same. On a 2040 ARM chip, we can bit-bang a gpio port and make a train
of 7 ns pulses, which is single cycles with a 133 Mhz clock. RiscV
can't do better than that.
It would be cool if the floating point ops were faster, in either
mode. On a 2040, the usual single-precision things take ballpark 600
ns.

C compiler may make a difference, need GCC with output for that processor.
I have no idea, likely will get some development package with the right gcc.

https://wiki.riscv.org/display/HOME/Toolchain+Projects

Jan Panteltje

2024-08-14 11:04:16 UTC

Permalink

On a sunny day (Wed, 14 Aug 2024 18:56:49 +0800) it happened Sylvia Else

Post by Sylvia Else

Post by Jan Panteltje
On a sunny day (Sun, 11 Aug 2024 12:02:20 -0700) it happened John Larkin

Post by John Larkin

Post by Jan Panteltje
On a sunny day (Sat, 10 Aug 2024 09:45:36 -0700) it happened John Larkin

Post by John Larkin

That's amazing. The Pi stuff is incredible.
We're designing around the RP2040 chip now. Dual-core ARM for 70
cents. It's rated at 133 MHz max, but overclocks to about 400. Some
lunatic froze one and ran the core voltage up and got it to work at 1
GHz.
We're now designing an interposer board, to connect to a Pi 400 on one
end and to a 20-pin ribbon cable, to our DUTs, on the other, for
development and for production test both. I can post the schematic if
anyone is interested.

I am curious to the performance of that RISC-V processor core.
I may order a Pico 2 if I see it in the webshops here (not yet it seems, just checked).

It is strange to get a choice of CPU!
I'd expect that at the bit-bang level, performance will be about the
same. On a 2040 ARM chip, we can bit-bang a gpio port and make a train
of 7 ns pulses, which is single cycles with a 133 Mhz clock. RiscV
can't do better than that.
It would be cool if the floating point ops were faster, in either
mode. On a 2040, the usual single-precision things take ballpark 600
ns.

C compiler may make a difference, need GCC with output for that processor.
I have no idea, likely will get some development package with the right gcc.

https://wiki.riscv.org/display/HOME/Toolchain+Projects

OK, nice, thank you!

Lasse Langwadt

2024-08-12 19:47:14 UTC

Permalink

Post by John Larkin

That's amazing. The Pi stuff is incredible.
We're designing around the RP2040 chip now. Dual-core ARM for 70
cents. It's rated at 133 MHz max, but overclocks to about 400. Some
lunatic froze one and ran the core voltage up and got it to work at 1
GHz.
We're now designing an interposer board, to connect to a Pi 400 on one
end and to a 20-pin ribbon cable, to our DUTs, on the other, for
development and for production test both. I can post the schematic if
anyone is interested.

haven't you been designing that for years now? trying to out do Slowman? :P

John Larkin

2024-08-12 21:53:13 UTC

Permalink

Post by Lasse Langwadt

Post by John Larkin

That's amazing. The Pi stuff is incredible.
We're designing around the RP2040 chip now. Dual-core ARM for 70
cents. It's rated at 133 MHz max, but overclocks to about 400. Some
lunatic froze one and ran the core voltage up and got it to work at 1
GHz.
We're now designing an interposer board, to connect to a Pi 400 on one
end and to a 20-pin ribbon cable, to our DUTs, on the other, for
development and for production test both. I can post the schematic if
anyone is interested.

haven't you been designing that for years now? trying to out do Slowman? :P

I've been thinking about a new product line for a year or so, but I'm
now hiring engineers and doing the first PCB layouts to make it real.

I had some other projects to finish.

Outdoing Sloman is a mathematical dilemma, dividing by zero.